#24 INTERVIEW OF BLACK STUDENTS ENROLLED AT WASHINGTON AND LEE 1. Have you decided upon a college major? Ifyes, what? Politics and German 2. (Ifthe answer to do question 1 is no, skip #7.) What is your grade point average (GPA) in your major field? No, I just switched majors. 3. What type ofdegree are you working toward at Washington and Lee? BA 4. What is the occupation or profession you want to do enter upon finishing your education? Law 5. Do you plan on working toward an advanced degree at some time after finishing your undergraduate program? yes 6. While growing up, did you attend or were you personally active in church? Yes Ifyes, please give the denomination, and the type ofchurch activities in which you participated. I've been involved in various denominations which include Baptist, Protestant [], and activities would be church youth group. How would you characterize your church involvement in Lexington? Revived. 7. How would you compare your level ofparticipation in extra-curricular activities in high school and at Washington and Lee? In high school very involved, and here I'd say involved. 8. How did you learn about Washington and Lee University? W &L literature W &L admissions counselor Relative Adult friend Peer Other W &L Literature and Princeton Review. Where'd you run across the literature? It was sent to me. 9. To do what extent were you assisted during the admissions process by an alumnus of Washington and Lee? To my knowledge not at all. I'm not really sure. 10. Did you visit the campus before you matriculated as a student? Yes If yes, under what circumstances? Visited on your own Participated in the Summer Scholar's Program Visited during a Prospective Student Weekend Other: I visited on my own and I visited during the honors scholars weekend. Please describe your reactions to do this campus visit. The first time, I think one of the sessions. It was in the summer time. And another time, with the weekend visit I enjoyed myself. Didyou get to go to classes? Well, there was a conflict with my schedule so by the time I got here it was Friday evening. What sorts ofthings did you do? Were there meetings ... Interviews, basically. Did you get to meet minority students while you were here? That was not scheduled, and I just happened to bump into 2 minority students in the University Center, and I asked them how they enjoyed their time here. And what kind offeedback did you get? Positive. So, your reactions to the visit were? ... What was your impression? Overall the campus seemed friendly. However, I did not really enjoy my stay with my host. I spent more time with others on the hall, who were sort of -had the job of babysitting, or .. Are you saying the host didn't take it seriously? Probably, I think she was involved in a sorority function, so that probably took away from her time. 1Oa. Was W &L your ... First choice Second choice Third choice Less than third choice Less than third 1Ob. About how many other colleges did you apply to do?... No other One Two Three Four Five Six or more Ten 1Oc. How many other colleges accepted you? None One Two Three Four Five Six Seven 11. What made you decide to do attend Washington and Lee? Good academic reputation. Offered financial assistance. Special programs that I was interested in. What were they? Study abroad, and I guess the pre-med studies. And, that was about it. And also the size of the college. Out ofthose seven schools that you were accepted to, what really made the difference, that made you choose W &L, do you think? Well, it wasn't the location, because I didn't plan to stay in Virginia. Probably the ranking. Were there other factors you considered in making the decision? Such as? It's up to you. I think they tagged that on there in case the list didn 't include things that were on your mind. They were covered. 12. Once you decided to do enroll at W&L, what was the reaction offriends and relatives? Most of the people I talked to initially hadn't heard of it, and then after I was accepted, people started saying that they had heard of the school, that sort of thing. So it was a positive response? Yes, as far as the academic reputation. And I hadn't heard of the social environment from anyone at home. So you didn't get reactions about that? No. Were there negative images about W &L that made you think seriously about not coming? No. 13. Once you were enrolled, did you find the University to do be as you had expected? How long into it? Whatever you think is relevant. Well I guess that would depend on my standpoint now, or ... Well, why don't you say both right as a freshman, early on, and now that you 're used to it. How does that compare? With the exception of my science courses I've found my high school work load to be more rigorous than the work here. And I guess, now, as far as the university .. I wasn't aware that the school lacked the diversity that it does. So that's more limited than you had expected it to be .. Actually I didn't know of any statistics that gave the different representations, and like I said, I did not meet with any minority groups or that type of thing while I was here, so as far as I knew, this would have been a typical small college that still had Some diversity. Ifthe school differed from the way it seemed when you first heard about it or visited the campus, please describe how it differed. I think that's all. 14. Please describe what you consider to do be your greatest challenge at Washington and Lee. How have you dealt with it? Probably time management. And I've seen Dean McCloud about time management and that type of thing. [Bob, I'm certain that she was avoiding talking about the racial issues -she was very resistant to doing the interview. and was "tight" and seemed angry. she expressed the conviction that anyone who cared to could easily figure out who was speaking by their comments, and by their demographics. of course she's right. I did my best with her, and she did loosen up as we talked.] 15. How has your academic performance at Washington and Lee compared with your performance in high school? Grade wise it's probably about the same, but I feel as ifl've had an easier time. My high school was very competitive, so here I'm not, with the exception of the science courses that I was in. I'm not feeling that sort of competitive edge that I did in high school. Do you miss it? As you go up in levels, I think people tend to get more cutthroat when it comes down to academics. Here at W&L? No, I'm talking about at my high school. And, not really, it was a transition that everyone has to go through. I enjoyed my time there, but I'm at the next level. 16. What academic resources have you used at Washington and Lee? Undergrad library, science library, computer facilities, tutors, public lectures, language lab, visiting professor, and study skills courses -well I don't know, I guess that would be under study skills with Dean McCloud? Um hmm. Do you have suggestions for the development ofthese or other facilities? One thing I don't like is that, Word for Windows is not on any of the computers, and I don't particularly care for that. Do you have your own computer? Yes. Is it a PC? Yes. And it 's not on any ofthose? Not that I know of. J think they have it on the Macintoshes, but that wouldn't help you at all ... Although, ifthis is an issue for you, you might want to ask the computer help people, because I know they have, in Robinson, computers that can translate PC discs. that might help. I think you can use a PC disc there and use the program and then translate it. And I've had trouble using it when I get back to my room. 17. What factors contribute or contributed to do your selection ofa major course ofstudy? Interest in the academic discipline 18. Have you changed majors since you have been enrolled at Washington and Lee? Yes, I switched from pre-med chemistry and German to politics and German. Ifyes, please describe that change. Could you elaborate on ... [ she seemed to be approaching the questions as if they were potential traps] Well, I didn't write this question, but I think what they want you to do is what was involved for you in changing your decision about what you wanted to do. OK, I no longer liked the field as much as I should have to be a doctor, and I -some of the advisement that I got was not of the best sort. Such as when I should have taken courses, or the not doubling up, or taking MCAT -waiting to take it the senior year. I wasn't really told these things, and I wasn't really happy with the sort of advisement on certain things. I just, it became to the point where it was too much work involved with two labs. So your interest shifted, and there was some awkward scheduling based on not such god advisement? Not necessarily. Like I said, I had good advisement on the overall basis, but as far as MCAT, I don't think so. I think that that was something that probably should have been mentioned if initially it was known that I was having trouble in any of my courses. That waiting till my senior year to take the MCATs, you know, is an option, because all through high school and when you get here, it's sort of ingrained that you take it your junior year. If that had been, I guess, brought to my attention earlier on. And also, I think as far as some of the courses I took, I think the school should advise or recommend that students should not take a upper level literature course until they've had at least either a writing course at this school, or either a freshman writing course, or they've opted out ofthe English comp. But I don't think students should be, I don't know allowed, I don't know how that would work, but I think it should be mandatory that you take English comp, or something -wither that or you pass out before you take a literature course here. Lit in translation or English lit? Lit in translation, or a foreign language literature, or anything that involves writing of papers, because that can effect ... Sure. 19. Ifyou saw a person or group ofpersons lying, stealing or cheating would you report it as an honor violation? Please elaborate. Probably not. It would depend on the circumstances, I mean if I'm taking a test I wouldn't be observing anyone else, so I would be concentrating on my test so it's not like I would see someone cheating on a test. And I mean unless I saw the whole situation as far as stealing or something like that I don't think that I would be knowledgeable enough on the situation to report that as an honor violation. Especially with how serious honor violations are and the fact that my accusation might have been false. So you'd want to be really really really sure. Exactly. And ifyou were, would you then report it? Probably not, because, I mean we have these honor violations and I remember at a school function, well not a school function, at a social function, my umbrella was stolen, so I don't really -I mean that's a small violation, but I don't really hold too much stock in it. You don't have confidence in the system. I mean, that was a small example. but I mean if people steal an umbrella then it could lead to other things, so ... I mean that doesn't address the issue, but I would have to be certain, and even then I don't know if I would. So where would your hesitation be coming from? Clearly you would want to think it over seriously. What's your hesitation? What would be weighing in your decision. I guess I can't answer that because I haven't been in that situation, and I guess the fact that I have to be very certain. 20. Do you find Washington and Lee professors easy or difficult to do approach? Please describe in what way they are easy or difficult. Easy, and the fact that I have pretty good relationships with the majority of my professors. I can either set up an appointment, or just happen to stop by and see if they're in during office hours. And discuss anything whether it be a class project or a paper. Have you been able to do establish close working relationships with a member or with members ofthe W&Lfaculty? Just answered. 21. What has been your experience at W &L with regard to social life? It's repetitive. It's basically either the fraternity scene or Greek life and you adapt to that or you go to other schools to have fun, or you stay here and do work that you don't have. So there haven't been many alternatives to the Greek social life? I'm seeing a few more alternatives on Fridays but that still leaves Saturday. I think there was a committee that has worked for alternatives to Greek life. In Greek life there is too much focus on drinking. I think Greek life almost dominates the campus. You've gone to some ofthe Greek parties? Yes. Have you felt welcomed? Yes. How important to do you is alcohol at a social event or social engagement? I'm not really sure what the question is asking. I don't use alcohol. Another way you could read that questions is, does the ubiquitous presence ofalcohol influence your enjoyment ofa party? Well, if you're in a situation where everyone is drunk, or the majority of the people are drunk, I guess you have to be tolerant of the fact that the majority of the people are drunk, because obviously they are going to act in a childish way. How important to do you are drugs at a social event? Andyou already answered about the drugs, cause you don't use them. Yes. 22. What experiences, ifany, have you had with Greek organizations on campus? How would you evaluate or describe any experiences you may have had? No affiliation, with the exception of Alpha Phi Omega. I enjoyed my first year of involvement, and my second year I found that it was too time-consuming with mandatory meetings and for me academics are my priority, and other organizations. I think it would have taken away. 23. Evaluate your experiences with regards to do athletic teams/athletic facilities/and physical education classes. I participated in sports here, and I guess it isn't surprising since this is a D-3 school that some of the facilities are not in the best of shape, with the exception ofthe sports that are ranked high in the nation. PE classes I enjoy because I do like athletics. And when I am not able to participate in a sport, then I get D classes, so I substitute. [?] 24. How would you characterize your opportunities for "dating" while enrolled at Washington and Lee? I haven't dated anyone here. I have a boyfriend who is not from here. I wasn't attached when I came here. Based on that, I guess speaking from the standpoint of a black female on this campus, I think the dating options are slim to none for the simple fact that there are so few black men here and it doesn't necessarily have to be black men. I just think that the fact that this is a Southern school, if there was a male who was interested in interracial dating, there might be concerns on their part. 25. Have you ever considered transferring from Washington and Lee to do another college/ university? No Why/why not? Because I'm doing fine academically. Ifyes, what factor(s) influenced you to do stay? 26. Have you had a paidjob on campus (including work-study)? Ifso, has this influenced your level ofsatisfaction at W &L? I do a little work with catering. That has not influenced my level of satisfaction. It was just something to do, a little movie money. 27. Would you be willing to do recruit other students for Washington and Lee either as a student yourselfor as part ofan alumni program? Please elaborate. I have done some. Talking to any seniors that I know, I encourage them to apply, if this is what they are looking for. I've talked to people in the Admissions office on ways to improve their recruitment of minority students. You said "ifthis is what they are looking for." How would you describe that? A small school, ranked high, academically forward, in what's considered the South, and it would depend on their area of interest. If the school doesn't offer something in their major, there's not point in their coming. Now we ask some background information: 28. In what geographical location did you grow up: Country: State: I traveled around the world. In what type ofarea or community did you spend most ofyour growing up years? Urban Suburban X Rural 29. Describe the type ofhigh school you attended. Urban SuburbanX Rural Predominantly Black White Mixed X 30 Please give the kin relationship(s) between you andfamily members in your home when you were growing up. Father, mother, brother. 31. What was the highest level ofeducation achieved by your parents, guardians, or others with whom you lived when you were growing up? Both of my parents were in the process of going for their PhD so they both completed under the PhD. What are the occupations or professions ofyour parents or guardians? Management analyst and teacher. 32. As compared to do other W &L students, how wouldyou characterize your overall social class position (based on parents' education andfamily income)? Middle class. How do you think this has affected your experience? I don't understand the question. You sense ofyour social class position as compared to others at this school and how it has influencedyour experience ofyour college years at W &L. Ifyou see yourselfas very different from others, or similar. I see myself as pretty much similar if the majority of people here would be considered middle­class. However, I do feel that non-black students at this University think that a lot of the black students may come from the inner city and I don't think they think that there are middle class black students on campus. So there are two different things going on. You see yourselfas middle class andfairly similar to the white students, but you sense that they see you as lower class. Not personally, but as a general rule. I think their perception is that the blacks on campus are not middle class. So how do you think that has affected your experience? Not a clear question. As far as academically? 33. In general how do you think about yourself first at Washington and Lee -­as a member ofa particular racial/ethnic/national/gender group, or as a student? I think of myself as a student but obviously I think others would throw me into a category of race. Please explain. 34. How homogeneous do you believe black students are on this campus? In answering please consider racial identification, political perspective, and/or social class position. I think we all come from different backgrounds, different school peer groups, some from mostly white schools or black schools. There are students who may be of mixed race background, so they may identify with different groups. I think, for the most part, our political affiliations are pretty homogeneous. 35. How similar or different do you believe blacks and whites are on this campus? Consider the same categories that are mentioned in number 34 above and add any other factors that you deem important. I don't know the social status of all the black students and can't address that. But from different conversations I'd say -I can't even say half or middle class because I don't know yet. Politically, the students who come probably have Republican affiliations, if that's what the question is addressing, and ­ Let me just interrupt you and say that there are no right or wrong answers to these questions and what's most useful is to get feedback about what your perceptions are. So, you can answer in terms like "It looks to me like ... " "I don't have enough information to say about this .... " I guess academically I think we are similar. I'd say the white students are more focused on status. That's a generalization but that's my perception. And again I think that they perceive themselves being different from black students. So that's a big difference ofperception? I would say so. I think there are students here who don't think that blacks have earned their right to be on this campus, whether that's academically ... How predominant is that? I can't answer that because I seriously doubt that someone would tell me that to my face. But, again, the fact that it's still considered a Southern school, I think that maybe a strong percentage. Is your assumption just based on your experiences in general or with specific experiences that you know of? Well, I come from a diverse background and it seems that this W &L community is more enclosed so that would be based on campus experience. Andyou 're saying that your sense is that the white students in general think ofthemselves as different from the black students and then you go on to say that you 're thinking that a lot of whites here may be thinking that blacks haven't earned the right to be here? That's how they think ofthemselves as different? Yes. A good number. So, another way to put that might be your sense is that the white students in general are thinking ofthemselves as better than the black students? Yes. And the black students think ofthemselves as white students? You want to know the black point of view? I don't think that the majority ofthe black students that I've come in contact with see themselves as being better than white students. I think they would say that they are equal on the academic level. The reason I am asking that is that you start out by saying that whites would think of themselves as different and it was your experience that black students do not think ofthemselves as different. Or they don't think ofthemselves as different in the same way that you have described the white students do. I am just wondering, based on other conversations J've had. Do they see themselves as different, or do they see themselves as the same? Well, the coloration is an obvious example, and I think that if it wasn't so much of an issue on this campus, then I think the race is a big difference as far as black students. Then again, that goes back to ifthey came from a predominantly black school, they may not be used to this atmosphere. I guess it depends on how well they adapt. 36. Do you believe the size ofthe black student enrollment at Washington and Lee is adequate or inadequate? Inadequate. I don't know if it's admissions or the school is doing enough for minority recruitment. I talked to University professors who have confirmed, for example, about the low number of minority students who ended up coming this year. There were 4 black students and the other 5 -well there was a pool of what the school would consider 9 black students, but 4 of those were from the US and the other 5 were international. So you can't even put them in the same category. But I think that's a way, when you lump them together, of increasing the numbers to the outside world. So, when we are saying we have accepted 9 black students, then I don't know for sure if that's what is being said in admissions records. But, I mean, our percentages are too low. I'd like to see minority enrolment increase, that would include international, black, Hispanic, the whole gamut of different races. Do you believe the number ofblack professors is adequate or inadequate? Inadequate. We have one permanent black professor and we have one black administrator. I don't know, I just feel that that is inadequate. I guess I can't think of any substantial support for this, but for the simple fact that when you have one black professor -ifthere were students who wanted to go to a black professor or administrator for maybe support or something like that, one is not enough. That shouldn't be the sole reason for bringing additional black professors or administrators, but I think that some of the students here, if there were more than one black professor that might change their outlook or maybe they would have more respect for the intelligence blacks in the professions. Do you believe the number ofblack administrators is adequate or inadequate? Explain. 37. Should the university offer activities designed to do bring new black students together? If this is the type ofprogram that has been at other campuses, I think that's something that could be worked on. I could see alumni problems with any type of "black" programs, specifically, but if they open it up to minority activities -I just think that if they specify "black" activities I can foresee problems from non-blacks. Ifnot, why not? Jfyes... do you have suggestions? ... I think there has been such a program in the past and it died down, so possibly ifthat program were reactivated. I think before there can be any type of cohesive integration ofblacks into the committees, I think there needs to be unity amongst themselves, and I guess that would come naturally along with wanting to know other individuals on campus who also wanted to -other black students -I don't think that a program would hurt that . . . . . . . . So I think it would be helpful. Has the Chavis House played a role in your life at W &L? Please describe. Just in the capacity of Minority Student Association meetings. Has the Minority Student Association played a role in your life at W &L? Please describe. I'm a member of the organization. It serves as support, to be able to meet with other minorities on campus. Has it been an arena where you have been able to find ways to work on problems that you have experienced? I guess, before I answered that, I'd have to think of what problems I've experienced. Probably not really. I can't think of any offhand. And what about as a social resource? It has been helpful as a social resource, and with social life on this campus as a problem, and that would go back to your initial question: has it helped any problems. And socially, it has. 38. Do you believe that it is important that courses in the humanities/social sciences include recognition or study ofworks by persons ofcolor? Yes, because that is what the world is made up of. I mean, I think there needs to be more course work that doesn't just cover the Civil War era and blacks as slaves. I think that there should be some type of courses that show blacks as being more than slaves, as being professionals, authors, scientists, and that's left out of the academics. Ifyou think works by persons ofcolor should be included do you think the recognition was adequate, inadequate, or excessive? Please explain. Inadequate. Obviously it's not there in the sciences. I'm trying to think of any other-I'm a German major, so it wouldn't have been addressed in that area. My literature is related to German. Politics, this will be my 3rd politics course, so I'm not knowledgeable in that area. But of what I've had, I think one of the authors that I read in politics was Martin Luther King, Jr. That was in one course. Between both of them we have covered Civil Rights issues, but it wasn't in depth It was more the legal aspects of it. I get the sense that you 're saying that you'd like to see more specific courses covering specific topics other than the Civil War and slavery. For example, African-America history, or, yes. Also if we just had a general literature course that covered different aspects, not just blacks, but a broad literature course that had black authors, evenly distributed with the non-black authors. I was enrolled in a course that might have covered that but I dropped it because of scheduling. So it may be out there, but I just haven't encountered it. 39. How would you characterize the climate in the classroom for you [as a black student}? I feel like I contribute. In most of my classes I don't see myself as a black student. But I do feel that sometimes, when ifthere is a racial issue that is discussed, sometimes I feel as ifthe other students expect me to have all the answers on that particular area because I am a black student. They may look to me to answer any ofthat, and that's not just at this campus. I also experienced that at the high school I was at. Ifyou have encountered problems in the classroom, how have you dealt with those difficulties? I haven't had any racial problems. 40. What is the role ofthe Office ofMinority Student Affairs? I guess it's supposed to be to give assistance to minority students as far as ifthere were any racial issues that came up, I think that you would go, if you felt like it, to the Office of Minority Affairs. I would think that the Office would have a role in helping to integrate minority students into life here on campus, knowing how this campus is. For me, one of the roles is tutoring, and as far I am concerned, it was not successful. The tutoring was delayed. I was not happy with the timing. It was on two separate occasions. So on that standpoint, I am not happy with that Office. How can the role ofthis Office be improved? More could be done by the Office to help minority integrate into the campus. I think it should be more than a reception at the beginning of the year. I think the office should be involved throughout the year and the students' time on campus, if the students' would want that option. Since that office has divided responsibilities, I guess that would have to deal with the time constraints of maybe it not being available or not as involved. There are a lot of functions that this office covers and I think that the fact that it is split takes away from being specifically for minority students. What could be done to help the students integrate into the mainstream? I guess discussion panels from students who are already on the campus. Maybe a reception with other non-minorities, just something different. Would a panel be for information for the minority students or information and interaction for the whole community? I was thinking of a minority panel for the minority students. 41. From whom do you receive the greatest emotional support on campus? Do not use name(s), but please describe the person(s) in terms ofrace, ethnicity, nationality, gender, and position (i.e. fellow student, faculty member, administrator, staffmember). Ifappropriate, include more than one individual and describe the type ofsituations in which the person provides emotional support (i.e. personal, family, religious, etc.) The two examples that come to mind, one is a German professor and the other is a girl here on campus. Their race is white. They are male and female. And in a different capacity, the deans have been supportive of me since I have been at this campus academically. They have always been concerned with how I'm doing and also personally they have been concerned with personal issues. I've been on several panels for the University so I've seen them in that capacity and in the office. I feel that ifl had a problem I could go to them if they weren't busy, I could just stop in and they would be willing to lend their ear. What percentage ofyour friends are black, what white, and what international? I guess if I look at close friends, I'd say the majority are black. Freshman year I would say that probably would have been reversed. Not necessarily close friends, but friends as a whole, I would say the majority are white, and the blacks are more so. That would include some of the international students. They are also non-black international students. 42. Have you experienced any discriminatory behavior on campus directed against yourself? What form did that behavior take (written remarks including graffiti, spoken remarks, physical assault, discriminatory treatment). Who was responsible for that behavior? Personally I think I'd say yes, and the type of behavior would have been treatment, a non-Greek student group. I wouldn't say that it was necessarily personal, but I think it was the fact that I was a black student here. It was a function. It's kind of technical, so -so there's no point in going into it. It's technical insofar as whether you see it as being discriminatory, but I felt it to be. And their reasoning behind it was not supported. It was more of a reflex. But as far as faculty or individual students, I haven't encountered that. Was this one specific instance? Yes. Individual students Student groups Greek Non Greek Faculty Staff Security Leaving aside behavior, do you sense racial tensions on campus beyond what exists in the larger society? Well, I think you can't really address the issue without including the larger society. The racial tensions in society is manifested here on W&L's campus. But on an overall scale, I think the students -I can't emphasize enough that this is still considered an Southern school and there are people here who, for example, support the Confederate flag for reasons besides the fact that it signifies Southern pride. I think that's used as an excuse. I think that within that Southern pride -I am not saying this is indicative of all the students, but for example that within Southern pride that includes the fact that there were black slaves. I think that's part of that Southern pride, because the South prospered off of that. I do think that there are racial tensions on campus. And for the size of the campus the tensions are beyond what exists in the larger society. Ifso, how do you think such tensions could be eased within W &L? It goes back to recruitment. If you have a more diverse campus, the problems are not necessarily going to go away, but I think we have that availability, it opens the campus up for more understanding. But if you only have 40 blacks out of a total of 1600 students, that doesn't signify diversity to me. Part of the problem is with the numbers and I don't think it's available. I don't think you can ease tensions with such a small number of black students on campus. 43. Aside from the Honor System do you believe that the student Executive Committee, the Student Conduct Committee or other University judicial committees treat black and white students equally fairly? I haven't had any experience with any of these committees. I really can't say. 44. Do you believe that the honor system is applied in an even-handed way to do black and white students? Same as #43. I can't say. 45. How would you evaluate student publications (i.e. the Ring-tum Phi, the Trident, etc.), the student radio and television stations with regards to do opportunities for black students to do participate. The opportunity is there. It depends on whether black students want to participate in certain publications if they have a reputation for being racist. I think it's the Spectator, for example. How would you evaluate them with regard to do their treatment ofnews about black students? On interviews of black students in either the Ring-tum Phi or the Trident, I don't know ifthis happens to white students also, but when you're being interviewed on black issues it seems as if the interviewer is looking for controversial issues to illustrate in the newspaper. I have found in my experience that comments that I had made may have been misconstrued so that it seems as if I am having a totally negative experience here. I am not happy with how the interviewing process is handled. Like I said, I think the interviewers are looking for something negative to be said. And a lot of what is said is cut out from the articles. It's like one particular quote is taken from say twenty quotes. The ones that have been chosen have not been positive. Has it been your experience that when black students are quoted in the newspaper ­Sometimes it's out of context. To your knowledge, have those black students tried to get back and get satisfaction by writing letters to the editor to straighten out perceptions? Has that been blocked or has that been available? It has been available. But that's just speaking from my experience. So you are saying that the treatment ofnews about black students seems to show a little too much interest in making things controversial. It's exciting news because it's controversial. I think that's the only reason that blacks tend to be interviewed, if it involves a controversial issue. There's not enough normal coverage. The only time is when it involves a controversial issue. 46. Do you feel that black students at Washington and Lee today have problems that are basically different from, or basically similar to do those ofwhites? Please describe in what way you feel they are different or similar. Overall similar, in that this is considered a difficult school. Then again, the percentage of blacks in private schools, that's another issue to be addressed. Blacks don't attend private schools in he same proportion that white students here have attended private school. I would say that private schools are more geared toward preparing you for this type of atmosphere, or structured academics. So you think W &L should try to recruit more black students from private schools? Is that what you 're suggesting? No, that wasn't a suggestion. But now that you mention it, that's a possibility. I'm not saying that the school should do something about it, but I am saying that the fact that the numbers exist is one of the differences as far as academic background. Social background is different and also economic background. So do you think the differences in economic and social backgrounds leads to the problems that they are having, being different? I think that if you're a child of an alumni or a rich student here, you have more connections available to you when you come and leave here. I'm not sure if I'm classifying that as a problem. I guess it would be a problem. I'm not sure where this questions is going. Well, where would like it to go? Ifyou thought, I wonder ifthe problems ofblack students on campus are different. OK, well, the problems for black students are racially motivated, and the lack of diversity. Students here complain about the lack of diversity, but I think it would more affect black students than it would white. *47. Sex F *48. Age? 19 *49. Year in college? SOPHOMORE *50. Cumulative grade point average [ as of Fall 1996]? 3.187 *51. How do you identify yourself in terms of nationality? AMERICAN 52. How do you identify yourselfin terms ofrace? Black. 53. Are there additional comments you wish to do make about any aspects ofWashington and Lee? I am not happy with the admissions policy. I think there is too much emphasis on recruiting black students from the DC-Maryland-Northen Virginia areas. That's important, but I think there should be more outreach and considering that the northern Virginia area is covered by need­based. scholarships and the other one is probably excellence, but it doesn't seem to me like the school is actually the one involved in the recruiting process. Because ifl'm correct, these two scholarship companies are the ones providing the money, and so that doesn't seem like the school is involved in that, and that's just a cover-up. For example, I guess this year of the black students the majority are from Florida, but that would change. Pretty much it's primarily from that area. I probably wouldn't be able to count on one hand how many black students -not international students -are actually from outside of the northern Virginia patch. I think that's a serious problem. I just don't think this school is actively recruiting outside of that area. And on top ofthat, I don't really think that they're the ones who are actually doing the choosing. Any suggestions? I talked to the Admissions office. I think they should recruit outside of these areas. Not exclude them, but there are other areas. Just talking to some of the people I know from my area, there are competitive high schools with black students who are ranked high in that particular high school, and I think getting quality black students who would be able to handle the rigorous academics here would not be a problem to find at some of these competitive high schools. And they are not just in that patch. I wouldn't say that I was recruited through the University. There weren't any college visits that I can think of. (No one came to your school.) I wasn't recruited for sports, so, I think there could be more done. Anything else? Just that the social atmosphere is lacking. I shouldn't have to travel to an area school to enjoy myself. I don't say that it's something that the University would be involved in, but as far as activities, I think there should be more activities. Not specifically for blacks, but available for different minorities. What kinds ofthings do you travel to? Social events, parties, pretty much parties, or I go out of town to attend movies, because this is such a small town, that first of all it takes a while for good movies to get here and by the time they get here they are already on video. And then some of the movies don't even come to Lexington. What's different about the parties that you attend and would like to see here? The parties that I attend, the people are predominantly not drunk, they are not drugged, I haven't seen any drugs, per se, but I have smelled weed at parties here. When I go to other parties off­campus the alcohol is light and drugs don't appear to be present. Considering that this school is ranked 1 and 2 in alcohol and hard liquor, I don't see that changing anytime soon. I'd like to discover what's different about those parties that made them successful and not having alcohol and drugs. Do you think it's just the habits ofthe student body here that make it so prevalent? Exactly. Some people have said the music is different, the way the party is set up that would attract different types ofpeople? I've found in my experience that a lot of black students drink heavily and considering that this is a drinking school. I don't think that would deter a black student from coming here. But the fact that it's that social problem, when they come here and there are not a lot of opportunities and maybe the parties are dragging. Some of the fraternities play music that might be interest students that are visiting but there needs to be more. And also, the fact that this is a Southern school, and as a prospective, if I had seen Confederate flags sprawled across the campus in the dorms as they are, if I had seen that, I probably would not have come here. Actually, I won't say that because that wouldn't have deterred me from coming here, but I guess my expectations would have been different coming in if I had known that people on the outside considered this a racist school. My expectations when I came here were simply that it was socially an average school in that it was not racist. But I don't think this school per se is racist, but the students who are here are racist. And that goes back to their parents who consist of alumni who are racist. The alumni are the ones who support the school. And how would you define racist? Discriminatory towards individuals not like themselves. Excluding subtly? Both subtly and obvious.